Switzerland sucks

• If you think the salaries in switzerland are "higher," remember that anyway the cost of living in Switzerland is at least 2-3 times higher than the rest of Europe, so your savings rates are much lower. Plus the social life and number of contacts here are extremely low, you're lucky if you find even 2 swiss friends after living here for many years. Racism and xenophobia are huge problems here and growing by the day. Unless you are a cheese or watch maker or work in a bank, you will find the other industries to be extremely limited and not very rewarding.
  
  Conclusion: Stay away from switzerland, land of over-priced junk and unfriendly, cold, closed-minded people, and go to France or Germany instead.

  30 Jun 2008, 05:39 Jack

Replies

• I love Switzerland = being racist ???

  It's really interesting to see how you classify someone who likes and loves Switzerland and defends it! The only thing I'm doing is defending it from dumb and racist people in this forum, who deliberately insult anything remotely Swiss without any reason (Swiss are retarded, Swiss blows, Swiss sucks, etc).
  
  Wendy: It's nice, that you've been invited to Swiss BBQ's - great! But again, you complain about our view of hospitality, because it's different from yours. Yes, in Switzerland you bring your own food (sometimes, not always). One helps washing the dishes. It's our way of saying "thank you" if you've been invited. Maybe the hosts didn't have money for the meat? Did you think of that possibility? I guess not. Another thing: Why don't you go to Spain? In Spain it's polite to arrive one hour later than agreed to let the hosts arrange everything comfortably. In India, you eat with your hands (how uneducated!! gosh!!) and in Arab countries you burp when You liked the meal (go there and see, it's not too far). It just proves again, that apparently we in Switzerland have to adapt to you - or we suck. We have to adapt to your concepts, or we are narrow-minded. We have to accept your criteria of what is good and bad, or we are racists. Incredible. Wendy: If you go elsewhere, you'll have to accept that other countries have different customs. That's the way it is. You don't like it? Stay in your village. I was a couple of months ago in Crete. It was full of drunk, loud, bashing Brits. Are all Brits like that? Hopefully not, but applying your logic they must be. How stupid, arrogant, ignorant and dense. And yes, Wendy, I'm a Swiss soldier. I spent almost a year with people from all different social classes and backgrounds. I think it's something, that would help you see the world through more humble eyes! Did you go to the army? I guess you didn't. So don't tell me to what to do, you spoiled little fat brat.
  
  AnotherSwiss: I've helped in a so-called "Männerheim" of the salvation army. I spent several days with drug-addicts, talked to them, listened to them, helped them. I took a day off from work to spend a whole day with one guy, who "touched" me in special way because we connected well. I know what it means to be poor and without ressources. Believe me: Switzerland helps people if they have nowhere to go. I've seen it in my whole family and I know what I'm talking about. But what's enraging me, is what I see and read in this forum: People attacking, insulting, telling lies about Switzerland. And all just based on single cases, they blow them up and generalize to the whole country. This is so stupid and arrogant. Only assholes speak like that.

  swiss and proud of it 18 Aug 2008, 04:37 - Report

• @swiss lady

  ah ok... you go to Colombia and you might get raped... or kidnapped (ask Bétancourt)...or even killed for wearing too nice shoes... but you would not complain because: "Heyyy! I knew it might happen!!"
  
  How spoiled and out-of-this world must somebody be to speak like that...

  the same Swiss, still proud 18 Aug 2008, 04:43 - Report

• So proud of being Swiss, you don't have a name...

  ... yet you bitch to those who have the balls to speak their mind - and in a negative way, not a good way. Hmmm. Looks like Swiss soldiers really are men of men, standing up for what they believe in. What a joke you are...
  
  And Wendy, if that is her name, at least speaks in an intelligent way trying to make sense of the underlying fact that the Swiss, in general, are just not very nice people.

  Positive image 18 Aug 2008, 04:50 - Report

• freedom of speech

  hey positive image: I say what I want and when I want, ok? Maybe people don't like what I say. I cannot please everyone. Especially ignorant and intolerant Switzerland-bashers. You've got a problem with that? Ok, say good-buy and "scratch the curve".

  Switzerland is cool 18 Aug 2008, 05:00 - Report

• @swiss and proud of it

  Like I said, You become help in Switzerland, but you pay it very hard. That you helped in a "Männerheim" once, does not give you the knowledge of the system. That you are a soldier, well my kids too, its not to see inside the abuse of power of many people working with the goverment. Single cases? Its not true. There are a lot of cases, I have seen a lot, I have worked with them, and overworked others. Another swiss may have seen single cases, I have seen hundreds. I have seen elder people, (not to old but not so young), crying on the stairs in the "Sozialamt Stadt Bern", because they took away their dignity. I made a research, and if you think the system worked for you, it does not mean, they are abusing of their power. We all are humans, and no one have the right to tell you, that you have no name, that you are now a file. Well hope that you necer will have any problems, that never a person smashes your dream down, just for thinking he is better than you. When I see that, I am ashamed to be swiss. When I see that, I go sad, Its a different way to be racist. Be proud to be swiss, as I was once, and I hope, you never have the opportunity to see inside the system, it is a shock. And, please, you have a very good english, but the impression you left with your last words, shows that you have the same level than others. Sorry

  Swiss Lady 18 Aug 2008, 05:13 - Report

• @the same Swiss, still proud

  How empty are you? You only know Colombia from the papers. 20 Minutes mantain you well informed. Well if you "Bünzli" minded, have a long live, go on with your little life.
  
  Have a nice day

  Swiss lady 18 Aug 2008, 05:18 - Report

• Swiss Pride aka Hidden Nationalist

  Gosh. Well, I was interested in your retort to my post, and in fact, was in agreement with you regarding different ways for different folks ref. eating (I still think that people who invite others to dinner should provide for them, or don't invite them - especially if you are loaded like my hosts tend to be! And yes, I dislike things about my own country like the appalling rubbish on public transport and I'm ALLOWED TO SAY SO in media, to politicians, to neighbours, without retribution or racist bigotry).
  
  And then you blew it with your name-calling (fat! spoiled!) and resurgence of nationalism since we are so stupid and arrogant as to tell lies about Switzerland! How dare we not gild the nation!! And the army!! What a joke that institution is! Would you have gone to the army had not you been forced too by the system? I'm sure, not.
  
  You just don't get it, do you.
  
  The intellectual debate has left this forum. We come back to the same points. Non-Swissies say, we are finding it hard here and Swissies say, you don't like it then fXck off. Open and shut. I really wanted to find shades of positivity from Swiss people who whilst having an open mind to opinions of non-Swiss, could help to further explain the mentality of the country. Thanks for a fascinating read and for taking time to note my thoughts on living here. I look forward to the invasion and revolution of free-thinkers!

  Wendy 18 Aug 2008, 05:24 - Report

• @swiss lady

  Stop talking assumed trash about people you don't know: I've lived in south America (Peru and Argentina), and I've visited other Latin-American countries in central America as well. There, you might get robbed and raped during the light of day. But oh well, according to your logic THAT doesn't suck because they never guaranteed to you it won't happen, right?? Unbelievable. Incredible. Do Peruvians and Argentinians get ANY kind of help from their corrupted, robbing governments? NOPE, NADA, RIEN, RES, ZERO. But oh yes, it does not suck, because they never promised they'd get anything.
  
  Hey miss, I have seen disgrace and pain in my own life. Switzerland was there and helped us financially and legally. So stop talking to me like a little kid. I went to the army (it sucked sometimes, believe me), but it was a great experience. An experience you'll never make because you think you are better anyway. You don't know how spoiled you are. Go home.

  return your passport if you're so ashamed od Switzerland 18 Aug 2008, 05:35 - Report

• Yeh, Proud Swiss!

  Way to go! Is that how you talked when playing virtual reality soldier when on your power trip with your little gun sitting in your smelly tank playing with your hitting stick! Ha!Ha! You do a cheap impression of Sylvester 'You talking to me?!' Stallone. Stop watching those B-rate movies and playing PS3! They aren't real, okay?! Not real life, get it!
  
  Made my day!

  Positive image 18 Aug 2008, 05:36 - Report

• @positive image

  yeah, believe me, the army service sucked big time. However, guys like you belong for sure to the first who call the police or army for help if you're in trouble.

  shut up dickhead 18 Aug 2008, 05:39 - Report

• Also taking my leave

  I share the same view as Wendy this discussion has turned into a circus rather than some constructive way to see things.
  
  Facts, like it or not remain the same, cultural difference, different views, racism, indifference, arrogance. People are still suffering within Switzerland, people are still beign misshandleled in Switzerland and people are still ignoring these facts.
  
  To those of you who help, who are willing to be just and take some action into their hands and preseve human dignity, I applaud them. Keep doing a good work, people like you are the ones this world need.
  
  To the others that don't want to listen and want to keep ignoring the problems I only warn them. Fear the day you need a helping hand because sometimes you will just find a closed door and nobody will look at you. What's worse, it might not be even you, but your children who will suffer the errors of the rest.
  
  Have a nice day!

  AnotherSwiss 18 Aug 2008, 05:42 - Report

• @Wendy

  Wendy, darling, tell me: Which country are you from? Tell us. UK? Ireland?
  
  Please let me know and I'll start a blog letting everybody in the world know, that your country is the most fake and most stupid country the world has ever seen.
  
  Will you feel offended? Perhaps yes. Will you defend the reputation of your country in the world? I guess you will, too. But of course, you would never be nationalistic, only the others.
  
  Shut up, hypocrite pussy

  proud swiss getting prouder 18 Aug 2008, 05:43 - Report

• @another swiss

  well then have a good night, fellow.
  
  just to let you know: I think SVP and right-wing politics sucks.
  
  See what happened? A moderate Swiss like me became a radical defender of its country because everybody in this forum thinks I'm an asshole - only because of my inherited passport.

  get a break 18 Aug 2008, 05:48 - Report

• What a joke

  You are all a joke. Blind go on. And some one have no learned other cultes, well wha can you ak frm a person hwho had s much problems, financial an legal. Beeing blind does not help to fix a system. You can keep looking 20 minutes. That is all you haveseen in Argntina and Peru? Rapes, delincuency, for Good sakes, where did you live, in the sumbs? Nw I understand, youare in paradise, our words, you just ha such bad expiriences, and if you lved there, you should know the other side of the coin, but reall now I understand you.
  
  again, hae a nice day

  Swiss Lady 18 Aug 2008, 05:48 - Report

• @swiss lady

  My daily lecture consists of: Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung, Die Zeit, Spiegel, La Stampa, El Mundo, Haaretz, The Guardian, NY Times and Tagesanzeiger.

  swiss lady, you are such an idiot 18 Aug 2008, 05:52 - Report

• @swiss lady, you are such an idiot

  Thats very instrctive, well done, at least we now know, you can read. My expiriences consiston a much broader information chanel. For example: I have worked with marginated people for a long time, here in Switzerland. Also in different countries. My information is not from the Frankfurter Zeitung, it is first handed. But I really understan you, scumbs in south america are terrible, must have been one of the worst expiriences you had. I ahve seen both sides, I had this fortune. o not be offended, I really accept, that you think this is the best land you ever could choose. You and your family are welcome, be happy, enjoy it.

  Swiss Lady 18 Aug 2008, 06:05 - Report

• @swiss lady

  It seems you had to revise your opinion about me several times. First you thought I'm a Bünzli, then you thought I only read 20 Minuten and last but not least you thought I've never been in Latin America. You are so stupid, arrogant and full of prejudices. You couldn't have show it better.
  
  Swiss señorita, so if people come to you and say: "You suck!" What do you do? You say "yes, yes" and smile stupidly. At least that's what I get from your answers. You have no backbone, backspine whatsoever.
  
  Swiss lady, you live in a pink bubble with Kermit the Frog. If you are so ashamed of Switzerland, return your passport. I'll hand it out to the first foreigner that's willing to work hard and show some integrity.

  Swiss lady believes in Santa 18 Aug 2008, 07:48 - Report

• @Swiss lady believes in Santa

  Please forgive me, but maybe he does not understand me in english I write now in spanish and if its to difficult for you do understand, german?french?italian? lets begin with spanish:
  
  He trabajado por muchos años en el campo de sistemas sociales, no solo aqui en Suiza, he vivido en muchos sitios del mundo. Yo no he dicho en ningun momento que Suiza es un pais desagradable, he querido decir que el sistema esta fallando. No es cuestión de pasaporte y/u orgullo, es el abuso de poder que utilizan las personas en cargos oficiales que presionan las personas menos favorecidas en el sistema. Yo no digo que no ayudan, si ayudan muchisimo, pero eso no omite el abuso. Como abusan:
  
  Denigran la persona como ser humano
  En vez de quitar angustias, la angustian con determinaciones arbitrarias que luego tienen que corregir
  Los jovenes tienen muchas limitaciones que los dejan sin muchas posibilades de salir
  
  No me baso en unos cuantos casos, me baso en los informes sociales de muchas trabajadoras.
  
  Cuando las personas preguntan por entidades que les puede ayudar a mejorar sus condiciones, las respuestas, no en todos los casos, pero en muchos, es "no tenemos ni idea".
  
  Cada dia se ven mas afectados personas suizas, que han quedado sin trabajo, que no consiguen Lehre, o que simplemente estan y se quedaron ahi.
  
  Que las personas se han vuelto indeferente ante esta situación, claro que si, muchos de aqui no quieren verse dentro de la politica. Me da tristeza ver que el pais se esta acabando. Lamentablemente si no hay una reforma drastica, en el cual se reestablece la vida digna para todos los suizos, dentro de poco estos privilegios se nos van a escapar de las manos.
  Te aconsejo, habla con esos seres humanos, que se avergüenzan de estar en el sistema social, ellos son seres humanos, que lloran y sienten, y se humillan antes las entidades oficiales.
  
  Con insultarme no sonsigues nada. Te aconsejo, mejora tu vocabulario. No me ofendes para nada. Hay una frase que pones que yo nunca he dicho,
  Swiss señorita, so if people come to you and say: "You suck!" What do you do? You say "yes, yes" and smile stupidly". Te he tratado sin ninguna groseria, mas tu me has dicho de todo. Ahora si, Cuando veo que las personas abusan de su poder y se esconden detras de una imagen, me avergüenzo, porque mis principios precisamente no son esos, depronto soy demasiado vieja y mis valores aun son los que altamente se aprecian en el mundo entero. La Suiza de hoy, no es el ideal. Ahora si quieres puedes escribir en español, a ver si no usas las groserias como ofensas. En todo caso te deseo una buena noche
  
  Sonja

  Swiss Lady 18 Aug 2008, 08:44 - Report

• Mira quién fue a hablar

  Look, chica, I wanted to give you a large answer to your posting, but this crappy webpage is already full and stuck. Too bad.
  
  Just this: I know of people who intended to abuse the Swiss social security systems. If you met them now, You'd think they are poor angels. They'd say: Switzerland sucks, Switzerland is a shithole, etcetcetc. But only because their fraudulent plans failed and they were cought.
  
  Guapa, you are too naïve for this world.

  Switzerland is beautiful 18 Aug 2008, 10:08 - Report

• @Switzerland is beautiful

  Thank you for the guapa, sounds better. Well maybe I am to naiv for this world, well maybe you just had heard from fraudlent people in our social security systems, I can asure you, there are a lot of defenseless people, they could not say anything, they are afraid. I had worked since... a lot of years, I allways tried to leve with my naive principals and never regret it.
  
  Sonja
  
  bye bye

  Swiss ady 18 Aug 2008, 10:27 - Report

• @swiss lady

  "you suck" means by the way "fastidias" and not "sóplame".
  
  www.ets.org/toefl

  have fun being naïve 18 Aug 2008, 10:55 - Report

• @have fun being naïve

  Why are you so agressive. Dont you see, that you are worse han I?. My questioning is people on public charges abuse their power. You see that all the swiss in need just are looking for fraud. You condempt the swiss people I condempt just a part of the system.And that what you say, sxcks, that depend how do you say it. That is the same thing like "pobre HP" to "HP pobre".
  Yeah I have fun to be naive, that makes me a better person, I believe in humanity, that makes me a better person, I fight for injustice, that makes me a better person, thanks God, I haven´t lost my ideals, my faith in humanity. Swear you, I will enjoy it.
  
  Sonja

  Swiss Lady 18 Aug 2008, 11:20 - Report

• Switzerland is beautiful?

  Switzerland is beautiful? Lol that must be some kind of joke... but it proves the point about how most swiss want to project a bullshit image that their country is some nice, perfect, clean paradise or something, and that they have the best chocolates, cheese, and mountains. All of that is bullshit and lies. Switzerland is the worst country in Europe to live in, unless you want to become a dead zombie.

  Switzerland is worthless 19 Aug 2008, 12:20 - Report

• Hey you stupid proud swiss

  leave wendy alone, you stupid swiss asshole. she speaks truth about switzerland and swiss people, and you can go f*** yourself in the ass if you don't like it, ok? and the british people are much better than you asshole, impolite, selfish, money-grubbing swiss people, this much i can say, even though the uk is falling apart, i would choose uk any day over your swiss shithole.
  
  you are a typical swiss nationalist bastard.

  Proud Swiss sucks 19 Aug 2008, 12:44 - Report

• are we dealing with anti-swiss scum here?

  who is writing in this "just landed" forum anyway? frustrated scum? human trash, that didn't succeed in life? criminal immigrants and naïve-stupid social workers? hey guys: if you failed in life don't come to switzerland. in switzerland only people, who work can enter. unemployed dirty-mouth criminals like you - stay off.
  
  i'm sorry that you country brought c***s like you to the world.

  suck my dick and eat my chocolate 19 Aug 2008, 05:55 - Report

• @suck my dick and eat my chocolate

  your dick is to dirty and the chocolate was bought by the germans

  laughing at you 19 Aug 2008, 10:13 - Report

• Nice vocabulary

  Hi to all
  
  I am not swiss, never have been there. Are all the swiss so decent? Do they really use so nice and decent words to express their feelings? I am scared...

  Heather 19 Aug 2008, 11:59 - Report

• @Heather

  Swiss are nice and polite people, believe me. The problem is there are too many generalizing idiots in this forum. Just look at the title and first entries of this forum and you'll understand.

  swiss 19 Aug 2008, 12:42 - Report

• horrified

  Man!! I've never read such bad responses from people who are defending a country! I'm not anti-Swiss, on the contrary, married one, have 3 Swiss kids, but why is it that if someone has something negative to moan about the country, the Swiss in this forum immediately believe you are trying to change their ways and culture!! Everyone is just moaning about aspects of Switzerland - not saying you have to be how we act in our original land!! We all do it about our own!! My 8-year-old has better listening, language and persuasive skills than the pro-Swiss here! There is such a lot of prejudice I'm gonna wonder if my kids end up like this! Hope to Christ not!!

  Ashamed of you 19 Aug 2008, 04:02 - Report

• lol @ proud swiss

  lol, Switzerland is in deep trouble: UBS is breaking down, Swissair is broke and sold off, Swiss "standard of life" is going down the toilet, racial problems, etc. That's because the swiss people don't work hard or efficiently, they only know how to blame others. Your society is built only off of counting other peoples' money, but quite honestly you produce nothing of value yourselves. And the sad thing is you live in a bubble, isolated from reality.

  Swiss people are blind 19 Aug 2008, 05:02 - Report

• @horrified

  hey miss, have a look at how this forum started: "Swiss people are a piece of shit, Swiss people suck, Swiss are stupid, worthless, retarded etc."
  
  Care commenting on that? Do you think that will change our attitude?

  Swiss and proud of it, like everybody else is proud of one's own country 19 Aug 2008, 05:06 - Report

• @swiss people are blind

  Thanks for showing again to the whole world what a poor little prick you are. Make a u-turn and leave. We'll get over it. Thanks.

  get lost 19 Aug 2008, 05:09 - Report

• To Proud Swiss bastard

  Your debating/communication skills are horrible, but that seems to be a common swiss trait. Too bad the truth about switzerland is now coming out, so all the tourist money is going to stop flowing into your bullshit economy built from dictators and drug dealers.

  Switzerland is nothing 19 Aug 2008, 05:19 - Report

• Dear Swiss and Proud of it

  Clever you! So you fight stones with stones? And swearing with swearing? You mirror their bad behaviour so you are equal to them. Not above or lower to them, but equal to them. Yes, some of the arguments are offensive against CH - but others are well-reasoned and sounded from personal experience. You sound a very frustrated young man indeed ( and yes, I choose to make an assumption about you as you did me - I'm a Mr not a Miss!). I think it admirable to stand up for what you believe in, but mate, change your style and maybe people will start to listen instead of feeling sorry or aggravated by you - they certainly don't change their minds in face of fury...

  Get yourself anger management... 19 Aug 2008, 05:19 - Report

• @switzerland is nothing

  Then I recommend you to go home to your own bullshit-country. We won't miss you, believe me.

  You are even less than nothing 19 Aug 2008, 05:22 - Report

• @get yourself an anger management...

  At least you admitted, that the vocabulary of the ones who started this forum is well below the acceptable. It's a start.

  it's my life 19 Aug 2008, 05:27 - Report

• To Proud Swiss Bastard

  You are the true Swiss in what you say. So why don't you say those words on the glossy brochures when you try to get foreigners to visit your mountains and work in your crappy shady banks? Tell them directly what you say on this forum, you cowardly, idiotic, blood-sucking Swiss asshole. Tell them to go home to their own bullshit-country, and that you don't need them. Why lie to them to get them to your stupid country to do the jobs you're too stupid to do? Why is the swiss government crying and begging about a skills shortage in the IT sectors? Swiss people are just too dumb to do those jobs, that's all.
  
  How long will your parasitic economy survive then? Stupid ignorant swiss asshole.

  Swiss people are fake idiots 19 Aug 2008, 05:36 - Report

• @swiss people are fake idiots

  Now have a look at that: You call me bastard, cowardly, idiotic, blood-sucking Swiss asshole. Nice. Are you wondering why the SVP is getting more and more votes? You are their best asset and reason for existence. Don't you get it?

  Blocher sucks and I love Switzerland 19 Aug 2008, 05:41 - Report

• To Proud Swiss bastard

  Idiot, you couldn't answer the questions so you change the topic. How typical of you. It's no wonder switzerland's only main industries are banking and watches. But even UBS is falling apart.
  
  P.S. I could care less about Blocher or your SVP, it's your country's reputation which is at stake. Swiss are still all dumb retarded sheep anyway, blocher or not.

  I will call you anything I want, retard. 19 Aug 2008, 05:53 - Report

• @I will call you anything I want, retard.

  Thanks for calling me again an idiot, dumb, retarded sheep and bastard and letting us know your attitude towards Switzerland. You couldn't show better that the SVP might be right (sadly).

  quit your job and leave our country if you're not happy 19 Aug 2008, 06:00 - Report

• Switzerland is GAY

  I often use this word when describing Switzerland in a condensed or abbreviated form.
  
  The word "Gay", in this sense, isn't used with any of the traditional ties to sexual preference, homosexual slandering, or even the previous connection to a euphoric emotional state.
  
  I use the word Gay in a more neo-classic/ contemporary-colloquial tense, ie:
  
  ex - man who shaves his body hair
  re - "dude... that's gay"
  
  ex - man with purse
  re - "dude... that looks gay"
  
  ex - any language that ends all words with "li"
  re - "dude... that sounds gay"
  
  ex - parking attendant who gives you a ticket for 2.75 minutes over the meter
  re - "dude... you are f#@king gay"
  
  ex - person who tucks their undershirt into their underwear
  re - "dude... that is gay"
  
  ...and I think you get the idea.
  
  Most of the other horrible things I could have said after 2 years in Switzerland have already been beaten to death here, so I thought I would try a fresh angle. Coming from Southern California, and having lived in many foreign countries over the past 12 years, I moved to CH without any prejudices or preconceptions. I had never visited a forum like this, nor had I spent any previous extended amounts of time in CH to develop sour tastes or spoiled dreams.
  
  I consider myself a very well-rounded person, culturally, emotionally, socially, scholastically, etc, etc, etc.... and I've never "disliked" a country, culture, or people in any of my travels or life experiences.
  
  Switzerland, with all of its nuances and idiosyncrasies... is a horrible place. I patiently count-down the days until my working contract here is completed.
  
  I would like to type this one more time... like a freedom for my fingers and an outlet for my mind:
  
  "Switzerland is a Horrible Place".

  VERY WELL SAID 20 Aug 2008, 04:29 - Report

• @very well said

  That text (copy -pasted by the way) is nothing less than another example of intolerance, closed-mindedness, arrogance and stupidity on the poster's behalf.
  
  So, Switzerland is a horrible place because (some) men shave their body-hair like Beckham, (some) men wear purses like some (gay) men in San Francisco, you get a ticket for 2 min over the meter (you might be talking of the US officials here, "regulations are regulations" and last but not least for clothing and language habits.
  
  Dude, you are ridiculous. If details like that make you think a country is a horrible place, stop travelling- seriously. In my opinion, you're the exact opposite of "well-rounded": You are ridiculously closed-minded and retarded.
  
  In other words: "You are a horrible person".

  Switzerland is a great place 20 Aug 2008, 07:20 - Report

• All words and no actions.

  Everyone here gives examples, good and bad. Defending their sides like some weird brain washed person because they don't know anything better.
  
  To the swiss people in the forum:
  
  Swiss keep insulting anti-swiss because they are saying there are problems in their country. Swiss posting on this forum don't want to show a little of common sense and say, yeah we have a problem let's do something about it. If you want to show swiss pride, show that you have higher IQ than a racoon (chose a random animal) and that swiss are capable of recognizing that there are problems in their country. Face it, nothing is perfect and it will never be perfect. But YOU, the one posting can make the difference of making a better switzerland. You are the ones that can do something about. One thing that life has tought me is that if people say something is for a reason. Think about what the things you hear from this persons that are anti-swiss and investigate on your own, is it true that things like that are happening in my country? Can I do something to solve them? Where can I halp? If you want to live by the swiss pride, at least do it the swiss way, the correct way. The good and average swiss will listen, the good swiss will evaluate the situation, the good swiss will solve the problem. Also remember if people complain it's because there's some truth to it.
  
  To the anti-swiss people in the forum:
  
  Yeah, sadly cou can get bad experiences in switzerland, just like in any other place of the country. If you attack the home of an animal, this animal will defent it the best they can. Bees will leave their hive to and sting people who disturb their colony. Instead of bashing switzerland in a horrible matter. Try to reason with swiss people, I bet you can find at least one or two persons that will reason with your problems and will guide you and even help you on how to handle things. Bashing through examples and making a good country look bad might not be the best way to act. This will just get the swiss persons more defensive, and like a bee, sting whoever says something bad.
  
  To all the internet kiddies:
  
  Yeah internet is a wonderful thing. Anonymous persons can say what they want and nobody will judge them. If you lack the vocabulary to take part on a decent semi-constructive discussion, the internet is very helpful on finding better suited words to express yourself. It will also give the impression that what you are saying was well thought. Stop using the comic-like language. It is respect towards others, and it is respect towards yourself. Everyone has their own mind and as such it should be listened and respected. Switzerland is a democracy where you have freedom of speech. Make honor to that right you have. Most of the western countries rely on this principle too and I think most are aware that freedom of speech is say and share the ideas you have in the proper manner. Freedom of speech is the right to defend your ideas in a way that doesn't insult others, doesn't bash others, doesn't treat others like trash.
  
  To everyone in the forum and posting here:
  
  Inform yourself about both sides, not just the stereotypical "post card" or "blick article". It's in the human nature to be curious, to know why things are like that and understand them. There are NGO's, Goverment Institutions, your local library, the salvation army, hotel resorts, parties, shops. Pick random people from the ones that buy pickles at the Globus to the ones that are shopping at the local Caritas shop. If you find injustice, inform the right authorities (Police and Lawyers is a good way to start, not all of them are as bad as they are shown). If you find poverty go to the Sozialamt. If you find someone abusing of the Sozialamt report it to the Sozialamt directors, they will make sure to handle this problem in the propoer way. If you tolerate injustice you are as bad as someone who is commiting a crime.
  
  Well guess I ran out of juice. Good luck in the future. Good luck on solving your differences and that it may bring you peace.

  Mickey Mouse 20 Aug 2008, 10:10 - Report

• @Mickey Mouse

  Very well said, buddy. I have nothing to add.
  
  If you've been treated unfairly in Switzerland due to your ethnicity/gender or whatsoever, go to the Beratungsstellen. They'll take care of it.
  If they don't take care of your issue the way you expect and you think they treated you in a racist/discriminatory way, bring it to court. If you're right, you'll win; if you're wrong, you'll lose. It's simple.
  
  And if you still think Switzerland simply "sucks" because things are/work differently than at your home-country, just leave. It's so simple, again.

  Swiss 20 Aug 2008, 12:08 - Report

• @ Swiss

  It's not about leaving because someone doesn't like certain aspects of a country. Why is this always the simplistic solution given by the generalist pro-Swiss? Are you not listening? People are griping about the country, not saying 'change it to the one i come from'.
  
  Of course they will leave eventually, but whilst they are here, adding to our economy in a positive way, filling jobs because we don't have enough people to do so (or interest by our younger generation unless there's at least 5000fr.), but whilst foreign people are here, why can't we just be friendly people! Really, our country is one of the least melting pots and least colourful in the world (apart from communist countries) since anything coming from other cultures is watered down and placed in a box.
  
  I welcome what foreigners can bring. And if they stay or go, whatever. At least we should benefit what they bring, and just be good people on a daily basis. Jesus! Some mentalities here are positively medieval!! Not 21st century, at all!!

  open-minded Swiss adult 20 Aug 2008, 12:50 - Report

• some reading

  For the just-landed and always-landed, I provide a few resources and recent articles that might be surprising on Switzerland. It is not just for expats. Many Swiss have also poke around. How else do Swiss find this forum.
  
  1. Book: David Hampshire. Living and Working in Switzerland. Look for a chapter tucked in the back entitled “the Swiss”
  
  2. Book: Margaret Oertig-Davidson. Beyond Chocolate: Understanding Swiss Culture.
  (This book is mainly on Swiss German culture. Those born here who are Swiss French or Italian also say this book helps them understand Sw German culture)
  
  3. The perception of Swiss being "Sonderfall" (special case), which strongly affects Swiss attitudes and has long historical roots.
  
  Switzerland "no longer a special case"
  http://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/front/Switzerland_no_longer_a_special_case.html?siteSect=105&sid=8909930&cKey=1207062813000&ty=st
  
  4. Doudou Diène, outspoken UN special rapporteur against racism, and approaches to asylum seekers and immigrants here. Prominent Swiss politicians have said Diène does not understand Switzerland, he should just leave. Many hits if you just google Switzerland and “racism” or “xenophobia”
  
  Switzerland Answers Racism Charges
  http://www.humanrights-geneva.info/Switzerland-Answers-Racism-Charges,1399
  
  5. Swiss women did not get the vote until 1971 federally, and not until 1990s in one canton (Appenzell canton was forced).
  
  http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/dates/stories/february/7/newsid_2738000/2738475.stm
  
  6. Switzerland was the last country in Europe to give maternity benefits – in 2005.
  
  Maternity benefit finally sees light of day
  http://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/swissinfo.html?siteSect=107&sid=5907013&cKey=1120117081000
  
  The rest of my message is my opinion. I do appreciate some of what Wendy and AnotherSwiss have tried to describe. I could spend hours writing nice good things about Switzerland and fine personal experiences but that is easy, idiosyncratic. Besides, justlanded want to gain knowledge, learn any surprising country facts and hear of any red flags for concern.
  
  There are many wonderful Swiss people that can hold both insider-outsider perspectives. There is also a large group here of ueber-conservative, image-conscious Swiss who do hold this country back, especially in the Swiss German cantons. It’s reflected in the way they vote. Things do change here and of course some Swiss can question their culture or country values. You can critique aspects of Switzerland and still hold some pride in your country. Isnt that more realistic? The pace of change here can be painfully slow. Yes there are black-and-white patriotic Swiss who will only consider Switzerland a “paradise”. That word is overused here. There is no country that is a paradise.

  just one post 20 Aug 2008, 02:03 - Report

• @open-minded Swiss adult

  Yeah, I totally agree with you, that Switzerland would not work the way it works without foreigners and their skills.
  
  But does that give them the right to insult us in such a rude way right from the beginning (bastard, idiot, retard, asshole, racist, etc just to name a few)?
  
  As far as I'm concerned, I never said Switzerland is perfect. You can meet good and bad people everywhere. All around the globe.
  
  But I have the impression, we Swiss always feel the need to apologize for everything, even if we are being insulted and scolded. Actually, foreigners told me so...
  
  That's not cool (at least in my opinion), it's living without a backbone. And guess where I learned to be proud of one's origins? No, not in Switzerland, I learned it abroad.

  Swiss 20 Aug 2008, 02:08 - Report

• cat hunting and fur trade in Switzerland

  if you want to know another weird fact:
  
  Switzerland permits cat hunting. they think cat blankets help with arthritis.
  
  http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/switzerland-finds-a-way-to-skin-a-cat-for-the-fur-trade-and-high-fashion-815426.html

  pet lover 20 Aug 2008, 03:23 - Report

• good grief!

  that's why there's so many adverts for missing cats on Zurich lamp-posts!

  animal lover 20 Aug 2008, 03:46 - Report

• Come on @Swiss

  if name-calling and swear words really makes you that mad so you lose your reasoning skills, no matter what people say, you gotta look at your anger management and personal development.
  
  Great. React. But react like an adult whether you are responding to immature or mature people. You just sound bitter and without point.
  
  If you or any other Swiss person has so much angst against foreigners, then spend the time writing on another Justlanded forum based on the country (not Switzerland). It will probably be interesting to see how other individuals defend their nations when someone moans about aspects of it.

  the Swiss adult 20 Aug 2008, 03:55 - Report